Should we Stay or Should we Go?


Matt - what’s going on. You’ve promised an update that will answer the majority of questions here, or shorter ones that give quick answers - but last promise was 7 days ago and still nothing.
We aren’t asking for answers that can relate to current shipments that you send out now - it’s the whole debacle up until now that needs some serious answering or explanation. I saw your update and 4-6 weeks means that we’ll hit the one year aniversary of “i’ve sent out 5 beta units” and still all we have are two confirmed deliveries to people that still can’t build anything.
I understand you are doing as best as you probably can - but you really need to come clean about the past year, get the units you claim are in storage out to backers, and own up to refunds.
Is it a money issue? Many backers have offered to pay you more just as long as they get their units they’ve been waiting for - some for up to two years.

Im still flaberghasted by how awesome this seems as a product, but it’s still nothing but a concept until users can have it and try it out.

Oh, and i read the update - it echoes of things said, done and promised during the last year but that haven’t happened.


Unlike @TomFolly, I liked the recent update. It read to me like less effort going into updates, showing an appropriate focus on packing and shipping. I’m also pretty uninterested in going over the ‘debacle up until now’ - we are where we are, with not many units in people’s hands, and I’m more interested in @matt working on getting units into people’s hands than raking over why they haven’t yet.

Yes, of course we would all prefer it if the numbers looked higher than 5-10 units over the last several days, but if it’s as slow as that, then to my mind that makes it all the more important to keep cranking on getting units boxed and shipped.

Once batches of units are heading out, people will need a way of building. As I said before, I reckon a video walk-through will be the quickest way of you delivering that - I’d urge quick and functional, not fully polished. Whatever the quickest way is of making good on the implicit promise “you’ll get a bag o’ Mugsy bits AND have a way of putting those bits together into a functioning Mugsy”.

My only criticism, @matt, would be that the forward view still seems too optimistic. If it’s taken about a week to box up 5-10 units, then you won’t be able to do a few hundred more in 4-6 weeks. The first step is to be honest with yourself - if you now know that you can realistically only send 10 per week, then getting through ~300-500 would take most of a year. Hopefully, with more practice etc. you’ll get the rate above that, but it seems implausible to leap from 5-10 in a week to, say 75-100 per week.


i agree i most sense, the debacle up until now are in my meaning all those units stated in storage all over the world, to my thinking getting those already packed boxes out to users would be faster and easier than spending enormous time packing new boxes if there really are 4-500 ready to be delivered.
Those could be delivered while new ones will get boxed in a reasonable time wich would be about 5-10 a week at the moment.


You assume there are packed boxes in warehouses all over the world. But is there any proof that these exist at all?


That’s what I’m asking for. As of now it’s Schroeder’s storage. It both could and couldn’t be boxes in storage


I think it’s safe to say that there are no packed boxes in storage around the world. In reality, there seems to be a single mugsy (his own) in existence, with two others in various stages of completion (beta testers…or really pre-alpha testers). His continued refusal to answer questions about the various explanations he has told regarding shipping (paused/unpaused, FBA, third party shippers, etc.), is a clear sign that those explanations were just bold face lies to try and buy himself some time. Likewise, the 5/4/20 update was not the first time that he has pushed this “limited shipping test run, ramp up shipping thereafter” baloney. The 5-10 units were supposed to go out yesterday and today…smart money is on a FB update late tonight that says something along the lines of “ran into issues with ____, had to delay shipping the 5-10 units because ____, will be AFK for the rest of ____, still working on the long-form update which will be out in the next ___ hrs, Discord Q&A has been pushed back to ____, that’s all for now!”. You can mad-libs the blanks from there :unamused:


In what can only be described as “history’s greatest twist”, the 5-10 units did not ship yesterday. But have no fear, they will ship today. Super cereal on this one, you guys


This is not a fun list, but is what I have gotten from the blog posts so far this year. I am fine with waiting, but I can’t read this and think it makes any sense.

Like, what happened Matt?

At the start of 2020, several hundred units are in FBA and 18 are ready to go direct

On the 7th FBA was still on track to move, but the 18 units direct are held for another two days (so from 6th to 8th).
On the 10th the FBA units have all moved and are ready to go. The direct units are now being shipped on the 11th.
On the 13th direct has started moving, but FBA now won’t go anywhere until the 15th.
On the 15th FBS and direct are both going out.
On the 17th, some other FCs in the USA and Europe are doing something.
On the 20th, direct shipments are in a ‘holding pattern’ until the 21st.
On the 27th, 10 direct shipments are going out on the 29th (not clear if these are the original 18? Those in the holding pattern, new?) the FBA units no longer get a mention

Then into Feb
On the 1st the directs are being pick up on the 3rd
On the 2nd 10 directs are going out on the 3rd and 10 more on the 5th
On the 5th the now 20 directs are going out on the 7th and the FBAs are back! They are going out between the 6th and 10th
On the 9th the directs are going out on the 11th. The FBA are being delivered on the 12th
On the 10th fba (up to 40 units) will be delivered between the 12th and 14th
On the 13th, the directs are on hold
On the 18th 1 unit will ship on the 21st and c202 FBA units are now being pushed back 10 days
On the 21st 1 unit shipped.
On the 28th, one unit had gone out on the 26th and another that was going on the 28th is now going on the 2nd

Into March
The single unit that was going on the 28th, then 2nd is now going on the 3rd. ‘other shipments’ (I have lost track) are going out on the 3rd or 4th
On the 8th, the shipments are going out on the 10th
On the 12th the units are going out on 17th


On the 15th the units are going out on the 18th or 19th (I think the 3rd direct has just stopped being mentioned now)
On the 19th the units were going out on the 20th
On the 22nd the units were going out on the 24th and the FBAs on the 29th

April 6th directs are going on the 8th and FBA on the 10th
April 9th directs are going on the 13th
April 26th the directs are going on the 30th

May 4th directs are going on the may 6th


When you lay it out like this, it looks like the ramblings on an insane person. Yet this is what we have been fed throughout this project. Imagine what it would look like if you went over the whole timeline, and not just 2020! @matt can even you make sense of this timeline? Or give us an explanation? I would assume not and you’ll continue to ignore these very real and pressing concerns


@andyd @tc23 I will jump on this post tomorrow eve and hit these additional requests. Cheers!


Replying to myself here, but looking at the FB post that was just published (~45 minutes ago), looks like I got Mugsy bingo! Shipment delayed :+1: Still working on next update :+1: Discord delayed :+1: And he didn’t say he would be AFK, but would be limiting responses to focus on shipping, so I’m going to give myself a half point on that one. Bingo! What do I win?? I hope its my Mugsy!! :thinking:


Thank you @andyd for compiling this brief 2020 timeline.

I agree @tc23, it does seem rather nonsensical, and your comment about " I would assume not and you’ll continue to ignore these very real and pressing concerns" was confirmed 3 hours later by @matt, with “I will jump on this post tomorrow eve and hit these additional requests.” We’ve seen this commentary before, with no follow up.

@matt, with all of these points raised, I’m afraid to report that I’ve lost faith that our orders will be fulfilled in a timely manner. I personally feel that Heymugsy, as good of a concept as it is, is not a pressing concern to those on your side of the project.

This thread is filled with investors that believe in you, and believe in this idea. If the end goal of this project is to become a sustainable business, accountability is something that needs to be worked into its vision statement. If we don’t have our product yet and there is little accountability, there will be none once we have a physical product and no way to assemble it when we inevitably come across issues.

I have not felt that my concerns have been addressed with actions rather than words. Seeing product leave the warehouse would be the best way to put unease to rest.

Unfortunately, I’m afraid that I would like to ask for my investment back. I am order number 577. I hope it can be processed in the next few days, and not over several weeks, as in the case of @MasterYety.

Once Heymugsy becomes a sustainable product, is launched, and has a good track record, I would be overjoyed to pay full price. Until then, however, I cannot continue to invest in a project where accountability is not a pillar of the business model.

I look forward to hearing from you with regards to my order and its refund, and I wish yourself and those still invested in the project the patience and good will required to take your vision from design to fruition.


BTW: yesterday I have received an email with the following content: “Hey Lars, looking into this for you now. Will have an update ASAP.”
I think this does not need any further commenting. :stuck_out_tongue_winking_eye:


I think it’s time to acknowledge that Matt is - for whatever reason - unable to deliver this product. My sincere advice: Put pressure on all channels to get your money back.


Thanks @Matt - As I said, I am happy to wait and a reply here is not something I am in any rush for. It is a cool product and you are doing your best. Maybe you could consider less communication on things that are predictions and more on what you are able to do.

I believe in you. Just shout if you need a hand with anything that means we all get our cool coffee robots sooner.


Yeah I agree. @matt please be honest and try to post only about things you have done, instead of things you would like to do.


@matt I hope you heed this piece of advice, but based on comments & the increasing number of refund requests, you have run out of runway and there is no more room with which to “kick the can”. I sincerely hope that you have verifiable evidence of forward progress that you can give today on your promised update. Should it be filled with more of the same (or worse, no update at all), then I fear this project is truly and completely dead, as the refund request will continue to come fast and furious. And as you have seen in other commentary, this will include people skipping over the Mugsy “refund process” and going straight to their credit card company’s for disputes and clawbacks. Again, you can take or leave (i.e. “respond within 24-48 hrs, etc”) this advice, but to ignore it will mean certain doom for Mugsy.


@matt, I think for everyone’s sanity it would help if you address one simple question - are there packages sitting in warehouses waiting to be shipped?

If the answer is “no”, please say so and maybe a path forward can be found. If the answer is “yes” then please explain what prevents them being sent on.


i haven’t read through all of the latest posts since Matt said a follow up will come tomorrow, wich then was saturday, has there been any followups?

@matt are the issues you mention in the blog posts completely new? It sounds as if you have known about at least the hopper for some time, and the fact that you have tried making parts to fix it - and the mention of hopper issues as early as february 2019 hints att it being a known issue but only you can answer that.
To me it seems odd to advertise it as complete and functional, by selling it as weborder, when theese issues are known. I know it’s a work in progress in some ways, but if it can’t really hold up to brewing coffe then it’s still an idea not a finished product - or a possible team effort, if it is released as it is so that backers can help you with build and orher troubles. I can’t really see the problem in releasing the units in storage - due to this, if you send the units with a notice of current errors - there still would be units in the hands of backers wich should be prio 1.