Should we Stay or Should we Go?


I agree with @BaconWithThat - getting kits out to people who

  1. have doubts about the reality of hardware existing (because of the numerous missed deadlines)
  2. can help making photos, writing tips on assembly
  3. can potentially even help more with the software when they have hardware to test it on
    should be the number 1 priority right now.

I had one kickstarter project where I never saw any product and never got any money back, so you should be aware that this is a real fear of people using kickstarter, hence there will be more and more refund requests if there is no visible progress.


The explanation still seems very vague to me, and therefore feels like more of the same. When you say you have “Limited output bandwidth” that is a meaningless statement to me. I don’t really care what is making things slow, I only care what is making things not move at all, from my perspective, the perspective of someone on the outside trying to find any tangible evidence there is progress toward people getting Mugsy.

I can understand the burnout factor, but I’m not sure having someone else manage a task list for you is really going to help. You need to dig deep within yourself and trust yourself to take charge of this project. You are in the best position to come up with a short list of tasks that need to be completed to move this forward.

I think what would help both you and your customers that are keeping up with blog posts and updates is for you to become completely focused on a single, short term, tangible outcome, that we all can see happen and be excited about, even if it does not mean that each of us has our own Mugsy yet.

A good outcome to make happen is for one customer to have a completed, working Mugsy, that they post pictures and videos of somewhere, who’s pictures and videos you will feature and link to on your blog. I think we can all calm down a little about when exactly our Mugsy will reach us personally if we think things are moving forward for someone. To do this you would literally pick one specific customer that is comfortable being featured in this way, even if their real name is not given out. If you are going to do this, it has to be to the exclusion of all else. None of the updates should mention anything other than very tangible ways in which this outcome is closer to being achieved, what your next step is, and what is blocking progress on the next step if anything. If you start talking about blockers or progress that have nothing to do with causing this outcome, it won’t help us feel better about the project, and it will mean you are getting off track.

You should also completely stop giving out unrealistic timelines and and estimates on everyone’s orders. Just admit you have no idea when that will really happen, and instead focus on when you estimate this next short-term outcome will occur. Don’t think of it as a goal or use that word. Think of it as an outcome. You can then come up with a series of steps that you know will definitely lead to that outcome. The idea is to both question yourself and build confidence. When you look over the list of steps, it should be obvious that it will really lead to that outcome. You also have to ask yourself if you have the means to complete those steps. If you don’t, then coming up with those means has to be an interim outcome you pursue first. But you would need to convince us that you really don’t have the means to pursue one person having a completed Mugsy because it seems far fetched that you don’t have the means to make that happen.


Matt, only a couple of points from me, mainly food for thought, I hate blockers in projects and with those chicken or egg moments sometimes you just have to dive in.

  1. Stick to your guns and take time away from individual fixes and focus on on pulling together the lists of things to do, thats an enabler

2.Same as above, take the time away from the individual fixes to speak to the community and get help where you can, we are all itching to help. This is dependent on 1.

  1. Let people know you won’t be responding to support messages for a designated time period. That’s a hard biscuit to bite but essential if you want to concentrate on things that need doing. The reality is these are either updates on shipping or requests for refunds. The first is just a time eater and the second should be respected.

  2. Create a faq and have it as a default automatic response to support tickets, I bet we’re all asking the same things.

Just come and chat to us on the discord, drop in, say hello, and we can talk through some of the issues, we can provide some moral support.

Happy to chat any time


@matt There is a lot there to digest and unpack, especially when combined with historical statements. But I’ll start with this question, if the inventory is available for all units, why don’t you get the DIY kits out to everyone who ordered one? You could also give the option of a DIY kit to those that ordered a completed Mugsy (not sure how to deal with the price differential, but cross one bridge at a time). I believe this was asked on a different thread with limited follow up. I think this would be a good solution, as people will give you much more breathing room if they have something in their hands. Cards on the table, I think you would be hard pressed to find someone who believes this is a polished product, or even more concerning, who still have faith in your updates when/if they come. If you were able to get us the materials to eventually build our respective Mugsy’s, you would see alot less pressure from the community


Mugsy : Coffe Now ! NOW !!! not 2 years after order.
@matt I don’t care about software tweaks and other BS.
Hardware is available ? Prove it, send it.


Thanks all! I appreciate the additional thoughts and follow up. I’m currently focusing on the primary task list with the expectation to finish it for release tonight or tomorrow. There is a lot of great advice here. I want to respond to any new questions as well as integrate some of that advice into the game plan, but will save that for tomorrow evening.

Thanks to all of you for taking the time to help me work through these issues. Will keep you all posted on progress and look forward to talking more tomorrow.


Hi again.
Great to hear that you’re working on the task list, but please don’t try to get ahead of it by giving deadlines public as they cause frustration if not followed.
Have deadlines, sure, but everytime you say something will be published on the xx:th or within xx:hours and then miss it is damaging to the credibility.

Just focus, and mainly focus on getting units to users - all else is things that can be done afterwards. And by now the two active discord beta users have become very silent in sharing any updates - pointing to that none has been made. We really need to see a shift in focus here again


To follow up on a question that multiple people had: What exactly is holding you back from packing let’s say 5 Mugsy kits, going to the post office and sending them to the first 5 backers? I think no one is expecting from you to fulfill now all orders within 2 weeks but people could help you with other stuff (e.g. the manual) when they get some hardware into their hands.


Thanks @TomFolly, I agree and will remember to more mindful of that.

@snud Thats the plan for next week. The next 48 hours will be working with the demo/beta kit users to make sure they have everything they need to finish their kits as soon as possible. Next week the goal will be to ship up to 5 kits.

I am still working on the update and will publish it here once ready(in addition to the usual spots). I will keep everyone posted on all progress and jump back on here as soon as possible. Thanks!


Hey Matt, an additional thought for your consideration: I think one problem that is quite time consuming is the fact that you have a lot of social media channels: Blog Post (Comments), Facebook (Comments), Forum (Posts), Discord (Chat) and E-mail. All of these Channels need moderation and people get nervous if there is no lifesign from you. Perhaps choose for each of these channels one member of your community, that is already active on this channel and ask him to work as a moderator for this channel. Then do a weekly call with only the moderators, so that they know what’s going on and then let them handle these channels. I think this will free up a lot of time, so that you can work on the blockers.

Apart from that I just want to say thank you for the work you are doing, to provide us with a great product! And I want to let you know, that I agree with the posts here that say, that first of all you should get kits out, even when some other blockers may still be there, once the kits arrive at customers that may or may not prevent them from getting it up and running. It will strengthen your credibility and reduce the number of possible cancelations, when the kits are already delivered vs. no kits delivered.


This! I agree. Theres too many channels to moderate and it will easily consume your time.


The one thing I have been asking is video update, end to end video of your unit. Surely, you as the creator of mugsy would love to drink the coffee made by mugsy. The fact that you dont have a proper working unit to show us is a bit worrying. If you dont use it everyday to make your coffee, should we?


This is the thread i was referring to

The promise has never been realised.


So… any update on that update?


Matt did upload a bunch of videos on different channels showing the Mugsy in action. I’d rather have him focus on the shipping than on making this kind of online content. Just my two cents.


Hey guys, I am following along with the posts/comments. Will be getting to all replies tonight or tomorrow depending on timing. Update is almost complete so you will see that tonight/tomorrow as well. I will be AFK for most of today but I am keeping tabs on everything that needs to be hit once I am online again. Thanks!


Hey Matt - longtime listener first time caller.

If you could find 15mins I’d suggest dumping your raw tasks in an Asana and then let Blane or whoever else can help, sort/group those. They can screen shot those or make it a public project.

It will help you prioritize tasks (SHIP SHIP SHIP) and help us see blockers. You can even stop writing updates as it will all be self-evident.

Based on your background I’m sure you use asana. As a dev who works remotely I live by it.


Hey @matt,

I just wanted to chime in with a +1 for the view that putting kits into backers’ hands should be high up the priority list when you’re pulling it together. Like, really high. Like put-all-other-Mugsy-work-on-hold-until-that’s-done high.

I know it’s probably a tedious job, and not as satisfying as finessing the build documentation or tweaking the software… but it’s the most necessary step.

For the build manual, I reckon making such as polished a product as you’re clearly trying to do could take many many hours. There’s a simple alternative - set up a camera, point it at you, and record yourself talking through as you build one of the Ready To Brew units. That would add maybe a couple of hours onto the time of building a unit, as you’ll be slower in describing than if you were just building. But that’s still a huge time saving over the time of making a manual. And for some users it might even be preferable to have a video build manual than a PDF one.

(Plus, it doesn’t stop you from promising the people who want a PDF manual that they’ll get one eventually, but can say ‘it comes later, once everyone has a kit and a way of building it’. People can choose whether to build from the video or wait for the PDF. Or start waiting for the PDF and then build from the video if they get bored waiting. Or start building from the video and then pause if they decide they would rather go from a PDF - it gives users options for a very small time investment from you.)

Similar thinking on the software side of things. Just stop working on it. If there’s something that will brew coffee, great! Anything else is bells and whistles. We can wait for those - or users can scratch their own itches if they want, but only if they have a kit in their hands.

If there isn’t currently a working build at all… well, not so good but I would still prioritise getting people their kits. Then, once a bunch of people have built it (following the video) you will find that quite a few of them will be able to jump into helping finish the software.

Best of luck with it all.


@Wildcards Thanks, agree re:moderation. The weekly call is a great idea and not something I have previously thought to do. I will be on the Discord this Wednesday so will sort out new mods for that channel then. I have some mods here already, so will just have to get them active again.

@Scott Agreed, I’m going to use Github Projects just so I can keep it localized to one spot. Just created a new board here: I will start filling these in tonight and finish up tomorrow.

@jim Good call on the video manual, probably something I can pull off this weekend. I’m currently working to ship 5 kits on Thursday. Will be posting quick daily progress updates between then and now here and on FB. Software is actually in a pretty decent spot right now. Starting some of that testing with beta users over the next couple of days since they can do interface and os checks even if the kit isnt fully assembled.

Ok, thanks all. Will be back here tomo evening for another quick update.


Hey there, I’m a bit at a loss. I keep seeing you saying you will update something in a certain amount of time and it not happening. I keep seeing shipping dates and it not happening. That github is empty and there is nothing useful on it, and we’ve been waiting for the update you promised for over a week now. I get the world is crazy and things are complicated right now, but we all gave you a decent chunk of money, I’m still not ready to get a refund yet, but I have little faith you are actually sending something out this week or that we will actually see the update anytime soon.

I don’t know everything going on in your life and I’m sure all that is coming out you is pretty overwhelming. We’ll all help you, but please please please, set very small and very easily accomplished milestones so we can get back on board with this train. And I agree with everyone else, if you send out units to everyone (not just 5 people) we’ll all be much happier and can help more readily.